Track Thru

Hi Ed,

You need to append Q Only to your syntax otherwise you're asking it to track from the final cue in your selection.

Cheers

Dan

maybe i should have mentioned i was in cue 101 and there where a few cues after cue 106.

I know i have used this syntax in the past.

when i hit [update] it posts current cue number [thru] 106 again tracks entire cue list.

i tried [update]101 [thru] 106 and same result.

I have never had to hit [cue only] when doing this before so it was odd to me. shouldn't  giving a specific range be sufficient? it is possible i was in cue only mode in the past....

oh and thanks Dan!

so as i pondered this a bit further and the need to hit q-only i came to this conclusion in my mind....

i see update thru as a cue only function regardless of what mode i am in.  in essence i know that i want channel one to be at 50 in cues 1 thru 6 and not any further i don't understand why [update] [thru] 6 tracks....

If I make a change live in cue 101, and cue 103 is blocked, I might use [Update][Thru][103][Enter] to get the change to track through the block in cue 103, and continue to track until it is given a command at some point after cue 103.

Requiring [Cue Only] at the end of a range update is consistent with the behavior elsewhere.  So while it's true that [Update][Thru][103][Cue Only][Enter] is far more common than [Update][Thru][103][Enter] in actual use, we do need both syntaxes.

~Paul

If I make a change live in cue 101, and cue 103 is blocked, I might use [Update][Thru][103][Enter] to get the change to track through the block in cue 103, and continue to track until it is given a command at some point after cue 103.

Requiring [Cue Only] at the end of a range update is consistent with the behavior elsewhere.  So while it's true that [Update][Thru][103][Cue Only][Enter] is far more common than [Update][Thru][103][Enter] in actual use, we do need both syntaxes.

~Paul

I do not agree.  When a designer says to me update through Cue 103 he means just that and not to track past that. 

If you want it to track past a block then it should be told to track.  To me [update] [thru] [X] should be a cue only function.  I do not see this as inconsistent with other behavior, in fact i think it is more intuitive. 

and really it is not constant because if you are in cue only mode then you would have to [update] [thru] X [track] to track past 103 in your example.  So to be constant again i say it should always be a cue only function.  and if updating a range that needs to track, then tell it to track. 

Bitten again......

I'm sure the designer meant "update through cue 103 and stop," but what he said was "update through cue 103" and the console assumed "track" at the end of the command as it does with all cue store commands in tracking mode.  That's why this is consistent behavior. [Update][Thru][X] is only a cue-only command if the desk is in cue-only mode.

There is no [Track] command when the desk is in tracking mode, so you can't "tell it to track."

It definitely took me a few attempts at using this function to get it in my head, but it is definitely consistent.  Sorry that it bit you again.

Regards,

~Paul

That is exactly my point.  The console assumed.....

and i know that it is dependent on what mode you are in.  I am saying to be constant track thru should always be a cue only function which ultimately makes it consistent no matter the mode. 

It only assumed you wanted to track because the console is a tracking console in tracking mode.  I'm the last person to let the console off the hook for assuming anything, but at a certain point these examples are not really assumptions anymore.  They're just rules.

You can't change [Update][Thru][X] without also changing [Update][X].  Like it or not, that's how the syntax works this console.  Changing [Update][Thru][X] to assume Cue Only (and then changing the Cue Only/Track key to post Track) would be an inconsistent special case.

~P

Thanks for the commentary everyone.  Am with Paul on this one.  Consistency always rules the day.    But let's assume we made an exception for Track Thru. Then assume you build a command line that is Update thru 20 + 40 + 50 thru 60 + 80 - and the desk was in Track mode.   The results of the command would be pretty confusing.

Update generally happens in a hurry.  And there are a lot of considerations already - break the reference or no, break a nested palette or no, etc.  The less you have to think about the results of that operation based on if you used thru, + or a combination of the two, the more quickly you can work - with more faith in the results.

In the early days, we toyed with the idea of Delete Cue always being Cue Only - because the times you want to delete track are pretty rare.  But again, at that point, you are breaking the track rules and you'd have to remember that we made a special case.  We try to avoid special cases in favor of consistency and predictability --- especially with anything that impacts show data.

:-)

a

Thank you for the explanation I understand all the logic you have put forth, but to me it is still backwards.   To me a track thru or + is a cue only function, unless being asked to track, and makes total sense to be cue only.  I do understand your reasons to not change it, they make sense too.  Kinda like Tevya i guess...they are both right...

But i feel gone are the days of button pushing for the designer, and as art and science become more distinct entities, designers are being trained to create art and asking the programmer to make the science work.

Ann's example still feels like a cue only scenario to me. The artist is specific as to which cues he wants the new level at.  I realize i just need to ask the artist his intent is to make the science work and press one more button.

Thank you for the dialogue!

One more thought about art, science and thru ([thru] [thru] actually

if an artist says to me take 1 thru 10 to 50 he means 1 thru 10, regardless of what flexi state i am in. 

If she says whatever is up in range , or the like, she means just the active channels. 

I still think thru thru should be the active channel command.....

sorry i am on a roll!

But seriously art and science are becoming more separate functions in theater. As technology increases we all need to learn to speak art....and create science.

One more thought about art, science and thru ([thru] [thru] actually

if an artist says to me take 1 thru 10 to 50 he means 1 thru 10, regardless of what flexi state i am in. 

If she says whatever is up in range , or the like, she means just the active channels. 

I still think thru thru should be the active channel command.....

sorry i am on a roll!

But seriously art and science are becoming more separate functions in theater. As technology increases we all need to learn to speak art....and create science.