Honest thoughts on the Eos

I'm using a brand new EOS on a show right now. I love learning new consoles, but to me, the software is just not mature enough, and in some cases is a step back from an Expression/Express. I hesitate to recommend the Eos to many people right now, because my programming time has increased, not from learning a new board, but it is just sloooooow sometimes.
I gave up trying to use snapshots. 2 simple snapshots, one for a live view and one for a patch view I like take at least 5 seconds to switch between. Even just going from patch to live using the live button can take 2 seconds. I'm a patient person, but not when it comes to waiting on a (new) console.

Also, if I just want to look at my groups using 'group+group', why does it have to be in blind? Is there a reason I can't have a groups list open in live? This also goes for all palettes I would like to open and see. I know traditionally ETC consoles have some functions and views only accessible in blind, but I much prefer the Hog and other platform mentality of Blind being a state of not outputting values in the programmer, not limiting you to only seeing certain windows in blind.

I also feel like Eos has increased the number of button presses that used to be fewer presses. Patch, rather than being one press, is now Displays+Patch, or Tab+#, or a custom snapshot of how I like my view arranged (again, taking way too long to execute my command). Release is now sneak+enter ( which means default sneak time must be 0 to act like release). Clear is basically backspace, which is fine, since Undo clears command line. But undo then also acts like undo, which requires the user to think whether they are about to clear the command line or undo the previous action and bring up the undo window.
To me, all these seem like erroneous steps that could have been simplified had the buttons been there. I know, different console, different methods, but I miss previously simple functions now take more button presses and programming time.

With any group or palette list open on an external touch screen, is there any reason I cant touch or click on the label field and change the text right there?
Similarly, on the CIA, in order to save or shutdown, it is so small to try to touch the correct line of text, so use and external mouse/trackball. Once I click it, then the OK is a giant button that is easily touchable. Some may say I am too nit-picky about good UI design, but it seems like a choice needs to be made. Personally, I hate having to use a mouse just to use a console, and would love to be able to actually use my finger to navigate the items in the CIA.

Fan- I want to fan my intels. The button is there, please make it work. (I'm trying to be patient)

Build Quality- Most of the board seems solid to me, the frame and intensity wheels are great. Having said that, the buttons suck. The keypad buttons are killing me. The poster of the Eos in my office has different buttons on it, that look much more usable. Why were they changed? The ETC rep who came and trained us on the Eos admitted that he thought it was not a smart decision and often has problems with accidental key presses and such. (Was his idea for backlit keys really too cost prohibitive? The glare from the littlelites suck [which can't be dimmed, just removed completely] and backlit keys, or even a hinged touchscreen would have solved this problem. This IS ETC's flagship console, right?)

The direct select style buttons on the side of the touch screens and for Tab, Format, etc. seem terribly crafted to me. They are loose and jiggle around, and have problems sticking and getting depressed too far. Also, to the right of the Scroll Lock, Select, and Page keys, if you put any pressure onto the front bezel, the Form button gets selected.
I gave up using the direct select buttons over the touch screens, but even the bottom portion that is covered makes the screen blurry and difficult to read. The mechanisms to get the direct selects or covers on and off is also poorly constructed. They wiggle around and never sit flush. I know this isn't a huge deal, but considering the price of the console, I would have expected better from ETC.
The black circle on the encoders- is it supposed to be able to spin or not? On some of the encoders it spins, on some it doesn't.

Speaking of encoders, I would love to have a menu option to turn the magnetic resistance off. Its a neat idea, but sometimes its like I have to force the console to change color scroller frames. Also, we've had problems with the wheels not working at all sometimes. I had a bunch of VL2500's, and sometimes on the CYM page, I could adjust C and M, but the encoder for Y would not work at all. I haven't had this happen recently, so hopefully it was fixed in the most recent update.

RFR- Handy tool, but still waiting for the next release. The base station must be unplugged alomst every time we try to use it. The remote has poor range, disconnecting from the base station sitting at the console 40 feet away with no obstructions. Once Ethernet is turned on, we can put it backstage and hopefully be able to use it. Also, I would love to be able to bring up addresses without being in park. Going through channel check also seems like a basic function, but is only available in park, requiring me to go back to the console to unpark everything before the show starts. I know a macro can be created to get around this, but I think it should be built in. Rather than turning a channel out, rolling up to the next channel and pressing Full Full, a channel check should automatically drop the previous fixture's intensity and bring up the next.

I'm sure many of the problems I am having are operator error (me), or they are there, just not apparent to me. I'm really not as angry as my post sounds, but to me its frustrating when more complex, not-used-often features were finished before simple, useful functions (Changing the frequency of errors on the console doesn't do much for me besides providing the best console entertainment other than space invaders on the GrandMA). The future of Eos/Ion platform is exciting (I know the intentions of the audio-in jack, and I can't wait for the day to tell the console what to do) and there are some many things I love about the console I didn't mention (Drawing effects by touch=cool). At this time, I think more development needs to take place before I can recommend the Eos to someone making a purchase or using one on a show. I look forward to other's thoughts and answers.

-Kirk Fitzgerald 

Parents
  • kirkfitz:

    I love learning new consoles, but to me, the software is just not mature enough, and in some cases is a step back from an Expression/Express. 

    I just have a very quick comment about your thoughts. You mention having experience with Express/Expression, however this is not the ETC console to be comparing the EOS to. If you have had any experience with the Obsession, you would probably have a much easier time with the transitions. The syntax between the two consoles is much more similar, and you would know that "release" also does not exist on the Obsession. 

    Also, you make coparisons to the Hog. This is also not the console to compare EOS to. You have to look at your application for the console. The Hog has probably been on every major rock and roll show around. You don't see very many Obsessions there, right? The place that I find Obsession/EOS most usable is in a theatre enviornment. Admittidly, EOS would be good on the road with the multiple cue lists and such, but I think the niche is the theatre.

    I use the Ion, and I feel like this is probably one of the greatest consoles I have come across in awhile... for my application in a theatre. I do side jobs where I use Avolites consoles for rock and roll, and I would never use the Ion/Eos for those. Ion has just a ton of features that I couldnt get out of the Expression 3 we had before. The networking stuff is incredible, I love being able to drop a node anywhere with a piece of CAT5 cable. I feel like the integration of moving lights has finally arrived on ETC consoles. 

    I am not trying to be defensive or offensive here, just giving my personal opinion. I know the software is in constant development, so it can only get better!

     

Reply
  • kirkfitz:

    I love learning new consoles, but to me, the software is just not mature enough, and in some cases is a step back from an Expression/Express. 

    I just have a very quick comment about your thoughts. You mention having experience with Express/Expression, however this is not the ETC console to be comparing the EOS to. If you have had any experience with the Obsession, you would probably have a much easier time with the transitions. The syntax between the two consoles is much more similar, and you would know that "release" also does not exist on the Obsession. 

    Also, you make coparisons to the Hog. This is also not the console to compare EOS to. You have to look at your application for the console. The Hog has probably been on every major rock and roll show around. You don't see very many Obsessions there, right? The place that I find Obsession/EOS most usable is in a theatre enviornment. Admittidly, EOS would be good on the road with the multiple cue lists and such, but I think the niche is the theatre.

    I use the Ion, and I feel like this is probably one of the greatest consoles I have come across in awhile... for my application in a theatre. I do side jobs where I use Avolites consoles for rock and roll, and I would never use the Ion/Eos for those. Ion has just a ton of features that I couldnt get out of the Expression 3 we had before. The networking stuff is incredible, I love being able to drop a node anywhere with a piece of CAT5 cable. I feel like the integration of moving lights has finally arrived on ETC consoles. 

    I am not trying to be defensive or offensive here, just giving my personal opinion. I know the software is in constant development, so it can only get better!

     

Children
  • Very well explained thoughts, and I do agree with you. You're right, I haven't thoroughly used an Obsession, but I am aware the Eos platform uses many of its principles. The Ion is more of the replacement to the Express, but its the same platform as the Eos, so I think it is fair to compare a console to the one it was replacing. I used an Ion on a show last year, but held in most of my thoughts because I knew it was so new.

    I also understand that people won't be using the Eos or Ion on a rock show. Having said that, theatre shows- drama, musicals, dance, and opera are getting in newer fixtures that have previously been only used on concerts. Yes, the Eos is leaps and bounds ahead of any previous ETC console when controlling movers. I think the Eos needs to figure out its market and who is going to be using it. Many feature of "concert" boards have been put into the Eos, like you said, but I still see a lack of some more basic features that are more useful in theatrical applications, which I believe is the target user base.

    I really am not angry, I just wanted to share my opinion of the current state of the platform. It has so much potential, but it's not yet ready for me to comfortably use on a show, or recommend to others. I bet in a year it will be a much different story.

    --Kirk Fitzgerald  

  • kirkfitz:

    I think the Eos needs to figure out its market and who is going to be using it. Many feature of "concert" boards have been put into the Eos, like you said, but I still see a lack of some more basic features that are more useful in theatrical applications, which I believe is the target user base.


    --Kirk Fitzgerald  

    Hi Kirk.  Thank you for your input.  We've tried to be as clear as possible that Eos and Ion are currently targeted at the theatrical and television markets.  And in reading through the threads here, I think you can see that we are very much aware [ :-) ] that we have a number of features that our core user group are currently waiting for.   For better or for worse, our commitment is to addressing the needs of those users, rather than trying to extend the product to other markets.   So, if it seems that Eos has features of  "concert" desks, that is simply because those features are needed in programming theatre, TV or film.    

    We are still working on features for theatre, TV (and film), and are getting to them as quickly as we can (while making sure we don't go so fast that we risk the stability of the system).  In any given major release, our approach is to spend a portion of our time on "bug fixes", a portion of our time on extensions/tweaking of our existing feature set and then the remaining time working on new features.   Over the past 18 months, with the help of many of our users, we've matured the basic feature set quite a bit.  This has meant we put off developing some new features that we had initially planned to do this year.  But we thought it important that the core functional operation was solid and complete - and that the extensions to the existing functionality that were requested by our current users were finished.   

    Clearly, Eos and Ion do not have the feature set of desks that have been on the market for many years or desks that are second generation/make from platforms.  But we have a pretty large number of these in the field, with people doing fairly complex shows.  So, while some things are missing, there does seem to be a critical mass of basic functionality present - for a number of people, anyway!

     Desks are tricky things... you have to put the desk on the market early enough that users have an opportunity to shape it ... .but not so early that you can't do a show on it.  Undoubtedly, there are missing features (fan, global palettes, etc).  These things are coming.     If you've targeted the things that you miss and feel you can't do a show without, but still have interest in the product, my suggestion is that you keep an eye on our releases to have a sense of when you might want to try again.

    Again, thank you for your input.

    Take care! 

    Anne

     



    [edited by: Anne Valentino at 3:06 AM (GMT -6) on Fri, Nov 21 2008] [edited by: Anne Valentino at 6:21 PM (GMT -6) on Thu, Nov 20 2008] [edited by: Anne Valentino at 6:00 PM (GMT -6) on Thu, Nov 20 2008] [edited by: Anne Valentino at 5:54 PM (GMT -6) on Thu, Nov 20 2008] [edited by: Anne Valentino at 5:50 PM (GMT -6) on Thu, Nov 20 2008]
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