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    steve.traut
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Wiki type of Manual

eugp:

Hi,

 Might it be possible to create an online Wiki type of manual where users could annotate and post to a common, shared manual?

 I understand this would add yet another task for the EOS/ION team to manage and moderate, but the result would be a rich and detailed set of instructions and experience available to any registered user.

 After reading the entire manual and still not being able to find procedures and information I would appreciate this sort of resource.  Perhaps this is more relevant for new users but that is the point.  

trusswalker:

Hi Eugene...

 Yes, it's possible and we've even thought about that kind of thing a bit. Perhaps we just don't know enough about how to get there from where we are now, as it seems like it would be a huge undertaking. We currently author in FrameMaker as that gives the best ability to generate large complex documents with cross-referenced links and so on. The requirement that many companies/sites have of a printed document won't let us leave this primary source right now. How to get that content into the form of a Wiki is what challenges me.

 I've also been looking at some other software that would allow user comments to shared with other users via a help system or web-based documentation.

The short-term piece of information would be if any of our forum readers out there know of some good tools to help convert content into generic wiki formatting. The actual wiki side of things is actually easier.

In the meantime, I would encourage you to email me directly (straut at etcconnect.com, or our dept. email of: techcomm at etcconnect.com) about what other procedures and information you couldn't find or think needs to be added. We are working on updates for v1.4 right now and it would be an excellent time to try and incorporate your suggestions. I make no promises about getting to everything, but I'd like to hear what you have to say.

Thanks for the comment and I hope to hear more from you soon!
-Steve

Pat Immel:

I agree with Eugene that a wiki type manual would be a GREAT...a HUGE timesaver and a wonderful resource!  But I can sympathize with Steve as it would be a monumental undertaking.

 Here is hoping that something like this can be worked out.  Thanks!

Pat
 

eugp:

Hi,

Thanks for your response, I figured it is a tricky undertaking.  Allowing it to exist entirely on line, with no real print ability, might mean it could come alive sooner and then get moved over to a more print friendly environment later.  It also seems like a great deal of inter-manual linking would be great, but again, if it keeps it out of reach of reality, then I would give that up as well.  Most search engines, both if set up internally or even externally, will sift through html anyway, so you end up with a good index with just a search.  We often run rehearsels with the manual open in adobe reader so that a search for content can be done on the fly.

 Mediawiki looks tough.
 

 

Sincerely, 

trusswalker:

I have to tell you... this has sparked the conversation again here at ETC. While I don't know exactly what's possible yet, I have found a few leads out there on how to make this go easier.

 That brings me to the next question... What smaller/shorter/simpler document would like us to try this out on? (assuming the other necessary stars align in order to make this happen) I really don't see the 350+ page Eos or Ion manuals being the first thing we try. But I don't want to waste my time with something that nobody cares about right now either.

And for simplicity of use, configuration and maturity... I've been partial to PmWiki in some of the messing around I've done in my home life. I'll take a look at Mediawiki as well. I've heard other good bits about it before.

Again... key question: What smaller/shorter/simpler document would like us to try this out on?


Let me know what you all have to say.

-Steve
 

Pat Immel:

Thanks Steve!  That's Great!

 How about the Universal Fader Wings...it seems like everybody uses those!

 

Pat
 

 

Hi All...

This is the new home to this thread (and hopefully more like it) on the topic of documentation. And a continuation of this particular topic from the Eos (and Ion) Forum.

Please stay tuned for more information about a potential documentation wiki.

And by all means keep the suggestions coming. It's also been suggested that we try converting the RFR Setup Guide for a wiki document.

I hope to hear more from everyone in the forums about what we can do to make our documentation better. Additionally, we've got a couple ideas (that will be new to ETC) about how we can deliver that content to you in more useful ways... such as wikis.

Thanks

-Steve

  • An update on the wiki manual idea...

    I have converted a quick 4-page manual for the RFR into a wiki on my personal domain that's running a wiki. I'd like to convert one more short doc, get that posted and send you (anyone who contacts me as being interested...) a user name a password.

    I'd like this to be contained for the moment because this is hosted on a personal domain and an experiment. This will not dictate how or if we implement wikidocs in the future.

     
    I'll post another message once I'm ready to go with the next part of this... letting you look and play with it to see if you like it or think it would actually be useful. I can also set you up to receive emails notifying you when changes are made to the documents.

    Hopefully, more soon... I'm doing this as a background task.

    -Steve 

  • in reply to steve.traut

    Depending on which documents you are putting into the Wiki format, I'd be happy to help beta test the concept for you.  I've also suggested this to Kathy and the folks in field service for those of us who are authorized field service techs as an adjunct to the knowledgebase.

     

    Dennis Witte

    Holzmueller Productions.

     

  • in reply to Holztech

    Hey Dennis!

     Long-time no talk...

     
    I will contact you and any others that post (or email) that they'd like to try this.

     
    The main couple things that I'd like to know (once we try it) is if it's more useful to people than the pdf's we already post. It'd be great to be able to collect information on our docs from people (comments, corrections, whatever...) and be able to use that to improve our pdf/printed manuals.

    One of the things I'm worried about is confusing people so they don't feel like they know where to look for information. Forums, wiki, knowledgebase. Obviously, only two provide a way for you to speak up publicly, but...

    The first two test docs are planned to be RFR Setup Guide (done) and the Universal Fader Wing Setup Guide (not converted yet). 

    Let me know what you think... as I recall, you've never been short on opinions and you often see things in unique ways ;-)

    I'd like to hear from people on this and any other documentation desires...

    Thanks!

    -Steve 


     



    [edited by: trusswalker at 4:21 PM (GMT -6) on Wed, May 21 2008]
  • in reply to steve.traut

    Seeing things in unique ways......That's one way of putting it.  :)

    As far as the Wiki, my thought is the PDF document would be a good place to start, but perhaps the wiki could be used to either tighten up, clarify, or modify the language used to something that might describe the use off a product differently.  User manuals can sometimes be a little dry and overly technical. Also, the wiki could be used to expand on the definitions/descriptions of how to use a device without the need to print up a 500 page manual for the RFR that covers every possible use anyone can come up with (including putting a longer lanyard on it and using it as a motivational device on your crew.)  Also with the Wiki, one could put a hyperlink in the document description that would take you either to the article or part of the article that would help you.

    Again, until we are using the wiki and seeing what does/does not work, I can't say for sure if it would be actually usable.  I would probably also suggest you assign moderators to the various articles to make sure the edits are usable and not of questionable content.  I don't foresee those of us who would look at this as ones who'd vandalize a wiki, but you never know, as I see things in unique ways, and I'm not shy in stating my opinions.  :)

     

    Dennis Witte

     


     



    [edited by: Holztech at 5:51 PM (GMT -6) on Thu, May 22 2008]
  • in reply to steve.traut

    Hi Steve,

    I'd be happy to look at the wiki(s) if you still need help.  Send info to me at:


    ***

     at

    nwmissouri.edu

     

    Thanks,
     

  • in reply to steve.traut

    I would be interested in looking at this wiki manual.  Let me know when its up.

     

    Jay 

  • in reply to steve.traut

    A great example of an on-line manual that incorporates contributions by users is the PHP manual (PHP is a web programming language).

    http://us.php.net/docs.php

    Here's an example page:

    http://us.php.net/manual/en/function.mkdir.php

    Each page of the manual is a web page about a specific feature. At the bottom of each page are the user comments. Often it is difficult to figure out how to use a feature from the documentation text, but the users always give great examples that make it easy to figure out how it really works.

    This style of manual might be simpler to create/update and easier to manage than a Wiki.

  • in reply to Jay

    count me in as being interested in having a geez at the wiki manual

    cheers 

  • in reply to BrentFJ

    I too would love to help with this. I probably won't have much time to assist up until December, but I would donate free time as possible.

    While I see the concerns of having too many places to look. I have that problem with looking up my Linux issues, I do think that by having an official wiki on the same domain, or subdomain, as the forums will show it as authorative. People will learn where to look once they get to the site, and Google and Yahoo will do that job for everyone.

    Also, I feel that it may be a nice idea to go in a direction similar to Wikipedia/Wikibooks. Wikibooks is a great example of having different documentions broken down into sections and chapters and inter-linking them. However, for simple HowTos, Wikipedia's simple article layout would be great.

    Let me know,

    Drew G

    Theater Technician

  • Hi,

    Nice to see this is still moving.  We've been off during the summer but now that we are back at it the EOS manual continues to be less than fully responsive to our inquiries.  Not that you aren't doing pretty well, but I still believe us users could add greatly to a knowledgebase type of manual with experiential notes and examples added to the existing manual.

     I understand ETC doesn't want to confuse users on where to get their information, manual, forum, blog or otherwise, but I think adding a link under your officially published manual that allows people to choose a publicly edited manual would make it an obvious choice.

    Today I tried to cut and paste from the manual to an email and found the pdf manual locked from copying, it kind of shot down my attempt to highlight some of the board commands to the designer.  I understand their are copywright issues for your manual, but could you think about a way to allow this for registered users?  It is an issue that would certainly come up if you were to try out any sort of wiki.  It would be the first problem anyone even trying out an online editable manual would encounter.

    Sincerely,

    Eugene

www.etcconnect.com