Source Four HID PAR start-up time

Steve,

The cold start time is 2-3 minutes or so to get to full intensity.

The unit is non-hot restrike which means a 15-20 minute cool down period before restarting

S4 HID's get used in a lot of museum applications and should not cause any curtain fading but I'd think fluorescent should not either. If they are 'onstage' which curtains are they fading? The borders?

I would think that an HID is not the best choice for a day-to-day work light unless you were going to supplement it with something else. HID is great if you are going to turn them on and leave them on for long periods of time but it does depend on your application.

Let's see what some others have to say about this J 

• Acceptable voltage is 120V (+/- 10%) 50/60HZ only
• Operating current of 1.5 Amps
• Inrush current of <14 Amps
• Room ambient temperature should not exceed 104ºF (40ºC)
• Lamp ignition voltage is 4.5Kv, non-hot restrike.
• Ballast case temperature should not exceed 167ºF (75ºC)

Mike Meskill

Mike,

Thanks for your response.

Are your reservations due to the start and re-start times or are there issues beyond this?

So you will know, my reasons for choosing this fixture were:

1. Low power consumption since the fixtures would be on for long periods of time.
2. The footcandle output was higher than other fixures that use the same lamp.
3. All the fixtures would be using the same lamp.
4. To have fixtures that were rugged enough to be in a fly system without concern from flown items on nearby battens bumping them and causing them damage.  The former worklights were 4' flourescent fixtures without any guard on them which always made us very nervous that they would get bumped.
5. The lens options would allow me to use a common fixture for all purposes.  They would enable me to have the offstage fixtures high enough they would never be in the way of scenery coming off by using the MFL len.  They would also enable me to flood the stage using the XWFL lens.
6. Their being attached via a C-clamp would allow for ease of mobility if they were blocked by scenery.

Regarding the curtains, the biggest problem has been with a mirrored dance type classroom which is lit entirely with flourescent light.  It has black legs (roughly 15' tall)  on tracks that cover the mirrors when not needed.  The curtains most often stay in a bunched position (exposing the mirrors).  On the part of the curtain where the fullness is pushed outward it is faded a rusty sort of color.  The part that is bunched inward, thus covered, is still black.  The fading is more pronounced toward the top.  Looking at it I can't think of anything else that might be the cause.  I am pondering whether it might be a reaction of the flame-proofing to the flourescent.  Sounds like a question for the curtain manufacturers though.

Thanks for helping me with this,

Steve

 Steve,

 Yes, my reservations were over the restart time. But depending on how you use your work lights you might be just fine J

The curtain fading seems odd....maybe lower quality.... but I know very little about 'soft goods'

Steve,

I recently switched from metal halide HIDs used for worklights to LEDs. My application involves use on stage electrics which have five Edison outlets spaced out along 60 foot raceways. As best I can determine, they were originally intended to be on five separate circuits, but for some reason were all tied together on one (20 amps). These are switched and are entirely separate from the ETC theatrical dimming system. The 100 watt HIDs were standard industrial type fixtures adapted with a C-clamp by our maintenance electricians to replace a bunch of PAR38 (!!!!) cans. They pretty much ran 24/7 except during performances and most rehearsals. Here are the problems I experienced:

(1) I had problems with people turing off the wrong wall switch, then immediately turning it back on & having to wait forever for the HIDs to come on.

(2) I always had one or more lamps or ballasts out with my industrial fixtures, but I wouldn't expect these problems to be as frequent or common if you plan to use ETC HID PARs.  

(3) I also experienced some pretty severe fading on adjacent stage curtains over a period of five years or so. I certainly can't say that might happen with the S4 HID lamps and optics, but there's no other explanation other than the industrial metal halide fixtures used in my facility. My incandescent stage lights were not focused in a way that would have caused the fading. If you've not already come across it, ETC does have an application note regarding UV content of their fixtures. You can find it at http://www.etcconnect.com/docs/docs_downloads/techdocs/UV_content_S4_Luminaires_v3.pdf. As you'll see, the chart shows the % UV content with HID and HPL lamps cut considerably with the use of something called an Omnivex filter. Never heard of it, but a quick Google search turned up a bunch of links. If this is a big concern, you might look into it. I've not researched the UV output of LEDs, so I many not be any better in that regard with my replacements, but I cut power consumption (100 watts vs 70 watts & fewer fixtures).

Best of luck,

Keith

Mike and Keith,

Thanks to you both for your responses.  Like Mike I also suspect the quality of these curtains.  One clue would be that there are no labels of any kind on them.  At any rate I have emailed Rose Brand.  Even though these are obviously not their products Peter Finder has graciously responded.  He commented "my guess is that it's cotton and the red is a constituent dye in the black".  I am hoping someone on campus has better info on these curtains that I can send to him after the Christmas holiday and see what he can figure out.

And thank you Keith for your insight.  I'd love to go LED but I think the powers-that-be would choke on the price tag.  Also, the only fixture I've looked into is a 100 watt LED Fresnel house light fixture.  It listed for $1300 and didn't have the footcandle output that the HID had (LED @ 16'= 18fc, HID wall wash flood from TSL @ 16'= 30fc, S4 HID w/ XWFL @ 16'= 65fc).  Granted that's kinda comparing apples and oranges but it makes me nervous to see those low numbers.  My presumption is that I am looking for around 50-60fc at waist high.  Does that sound reasonable to you?  I got the 50-60fc figures from some website that did a survey on light levels in classrooms at desk height (don't ask me what the website was now).

Do either of you have any knowledge of induction lighting?  Though it may have the same curtain fading problems but I'm grasping at strawn now.  It looks like a version of fluorescent that is much more efficient and longer lasting.  It also sounds a bit like an invitation for wireless mic problems but thought I'd ask.

Thanks again for your responses.